tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-379287241318002122.post8316123413472358761..comments2024-01-28T08:54:32.914-06:00Comments on That's interesting...: A lie is a lie, even when the president says itBill Garthrighthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08552459555883204060noreply@blogger.comBlogger2125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-379287241318002122.post-87337384481167499972017-01-30T10:29:22.423-06:002017-01-30T10:29:22.423-06:00Well, Jeff, Vladimir Putin definitely worked to da...Well, Jeff, Vladimir Putin definitely worked to damage Hillary Clinton's campaign and help elect Donald Trump. There is also evidence that Trump, or someone in his campaign, got <a href="http://garthright.blogspot.com/2016/10/wow-it-gets-even-worse.html" rel="nofollow">information from the Russians</a>. (That's just one example.)<br /><br />I'm not willing to go further than that, though - not without better evidence. Did the right-wing <i>knowingly</i> "form an alliance" with the Russians? I don't know. Republican senators "knowingly" worked with Islamic extremists when they tried to sabotage America's side in our negotiations with Iran. But they probably didn't think of it that way.<br /><br />Apparently, white supremacist websites have long posted claims from Russian propaganda mills, but is that because they're working with Russia or just because Russian sites back up their bigotry and existing beliefs?<br /><br />Vladimir Putin's Russia is quite good at propaganda, and they'll use whoever they can. But gullibility isn't treason. (Admittedly, neither is admirable.)<br /><br />Did Trump know that he was just spouting Russian propaganda? I doubt very much if he'd <i>care</i>, one way or another. It's obvious that he doesn't care about the truth of his claims, and I'm sure that he'd use whatever he wanted, regardless.<br /><br />Were people within his campaign knowingly working with the Russians? It seems likely that <i>someone</i> was. Again, in that example I pointed out, Trump seemed to be spouting lies copied verbatim from Russian propaganda, and he must have gotten that from <i>someone</i>. But we simply don't know the details - not at this point, at least.<br /><br />Jeff, I don't want to imitate Trump and his supporters. I don't want to believe something just because I <i>want</i> to believe it, just because it matches up with my existing biases. There is nothing I wouldn't believe about Trump, if it were backed up by good evidence. But unlike Trump, I care about the truth of my beliefs.<br /><br />This is a very serious issue, though. And I agree with that last line, that Putin wins, either way. He has severely damaged America, and that must have been his goal from the start.<br />Bill Garthrighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08552459555883204060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-379287241318002122.post-79909348768471677142017-01-29T17:20:59.407-06:002017-01-29T17:20:59.407-06:00Interesting take from a commenter on Alternet. Nee...Interesting take from a commenter on Alternet. Need your thoughts on this:<br /><br /><br /><br />Kudos to Moyers for his spot-on diagnosis of this sewer-fire of an administration.<br /><br />And now there is also some hard, credible evidence emerging that explains the otherwise inexplicable madness leading up to the election; Trump, Clinton, the Russians, fake news, etc.<br /><br />Listen to the NPR Fresh Air w/Terry Gross interview with veteran Russian correspondent for the Guardian, Luke Harding, which aired Thursday, 1/26/17.<br /><br />Harding, who has reported extensively on Putin and written several books on Russian espionage, details how the Russian FSB (formerly the KGB) formed an alliance with the American far-right to pursue their common goal: The destruction of the liberal democracies in the U.S. and Europe.<br /><br />Together they employ a drove of online trolls that permeate U.S. blog sites and right-wing media like Foxnews, to sow disinformation, confusion & destroy faith in Western democracy. During the election they collaborated to elect Trump, who has definite financial ties with Russians, and is almost certainly hopelessly compromised.<br /><br />This is no bogus paranoid conspiracy you’ll ever hear on Alex Jones (guys like Jones, in fact, seem to be dupes in the FSB strategy). Harding has spent years investigating Russian interference in international politics, espionage and political assassinations. He was expelled from Russia in 2011. His latest book is “A Very Expensive Poison: The Definitive Story of the Murder of Litvinenko and Russia's War with the West.”<br /><br />Harding vividly describes how the American far-right joined forces with Putin to undermine the Clinton campaign and spread disinfo like ‘alternative facts’ and FSB propaganda, such as 'the U.S. is not a democracy' or that 'democracy and voting are wastes of time,' or that 'Democrats are just as bad as Republicans,' etc.<br /><br />These canards are then picked up and repeated by cynical or naive bloggers who are like 5th columnists in WW2, spreading enemy propaganda. As Harding says, the Cold War is back & this time Putin intends to win.<br /><br />And, thanks to the GOP, whichever way this sordid melodrama plays out, Putin wins because even if his scheme is exposed & Trump goes to jail, the U.S. has been damaged almost beyond repair.<br /><br />http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/bill-moyers-donald-trump-flattening-our-democracy-monster-truckjeff725https://www.blogger.com/profile/10997352384565837304noreply@blogger.com